tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7213937046537524165.post2861680770962386931..comments2023-09-19T10:07:03.906-04:00Comments on Original Mind: The Myth of ZenUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7213937046537524165.post-69279153501891960162013-08-06T20:41:14.144-04:002013-08-06T20:41:14.144-04:00Seems to me that the notion (and so often it seems...Seems to me that the notion (and so often it seems to be taken no further than a notion) that 'Zen is beyond words' needs to be qualified with the direct observance that words are already beyond words, and that meaning is already beyond meaning, and that that 'beyondness' is a nothing even a hair's breadth separate from the quality that allows them to exist and function in the very real ways that they do in the world... Otherwise 'Zen' might be a load of redundant old waffle.<br /><br />Best Regards,<br /><br />Harry.Harryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05168631752214481563noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7213937046537524165.post-35701633917215968202013-08-06T19:23:11.001-04:002013-08-06T19:23:11.001-04:00LOL! First time I have heard the real estate mantr...LOL! First time I have heard the real estate mantra. Wonderful! I will definitely pass it along.Alan Gregory Wonderwheelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00186755261777539572noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7213937046537524165.post-49121441953748065362013-08-06T19:20:40.065-04:002013-08-06T19:20:40.065-04:00(comment part 2)
The connection between Zen and t...(comment part 2)<br /><br />The connection between Zen and the One Vehicle goes back all the way to Bodhidharma so that it is the One Vehicle that is the common denominator of all the Zen schools today, no matter who diverse and strange those Zen branches may appear based on their cultural paths. In the “Continued Biographies of Eminent Monks,” the author Daoxuan, a Vinaya Master, tells us about the monk Fachong who was an expounder of the Lankavatara Sutra known to have lectured on the sutra well over 100 times. Fachong in his travels came in contact with and studied under “those who had been intimately taught by master Ke, relying on the One Vehicle lineage of Southern India to explain it.” This “master Ke” is none other than Huike the second Chinese ancestor of Zen who is famous for receiving the transmission directly from Bodhidharma. Thus we learn in one of the earliest non-sectarian descriptions of the Zen lineage that it was called the “One Vehicle lineage of Southern India,” which of course is where Bodhidharma is said to have come from. <br /><br />I honestly believe that Zen will find its suitable ground in being transplanted to Western culture when we who are followers of the many diverse and varying streams flowing from Bodhidharma realize the ecumenical context of what it means that Zen is the legacy of the One Vehicle lineage of Southern India that Bodhidharma brought from India to China. As Doshim says, Zen is practice and realization for saving all beings and this is the essential core of the One Vehicle as confirmed by all the One Vehicle Sutras such as the Lankavatara, Avatamsaka, Lotus, Queen Srimala’s Lion’s Roar, Great Dharma Drum, etc.. <br /><br />_/|\_Alan Gregory Wonderwheelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00186755261777539572noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7213937046537524165.post-11675514875837426052013-08-06T19:19:37.062-04:002013-08-06T19:19:37.062-04:00This is a very important topic. Thanks for raisin...This is a very important topic. Thanks for raising it.<br /><br />First, I agree 100% that we must understand which of the meanings of the word "Zen" we are pointing at when we use the word. But I would not go so far as to say that all the meanings are merely or even "completely conventional, provisional, and conceptual." This hits the most important point about words: the meaning is not in the definition. Definitions point to the meanings. If we think that there is nothing other than the word then we might think the word is "completely conventional, provisional, and conceptual" but the meaning is not bound by the conventionality, provisionality, or conceptuality of the word. This is the teaching of the Lankavatara Sutra which is of course the quintesential Zen sutra. <br /><br />Now, the relationship between the persons and the teachings of Zen is found in Bodhidharma as a living presence. So we can say unequivocally that Zen is the lineage of teaching that connects back to Bodhidharma. This point was established by Guifeng Zongmi (780 – 841C.E.) when he surveyed the Zen landscape in the first half of the 9th century and nearly singlehandedly popularized the adoption of the word “Zen” as the standard reference label for all the streams and branches of teachers who came from Bodhidharma’s descendants. Zongmi identified at least 9 distinguishable branches in the tree of Zen, and these branches stemmed from the 4th, 5th, and 6th Zen ancestors. <br /><br />By identifying how they all stemmed from Bodhidharma and how they all related to the essential teachings of Bodhidharma, even though they had distinguishable features of emphasis, Zongmi established in the minds of both the literati and the populace the fact that there was a Zen school then functioning alive and well in China. Zongmi clearly established that there was no single model for how to practice Zen and that all the apparent differences were brought together and made understandable as one school in reference to Bodhidharma.<br /><br />The importance of Zongmi has been lost to many Zen students, especially to those of the Japanese lineages because of the emphasis of sectarianism between Soto and Rinzai streams and the cultural chauvinism of many of the Japanese teachers. I would argue that the Korean lineages (as an institution) have maintained their ecumenicalism precisely because the main founder of modern Korean Zen, Pojo Chinul (1158-1210) was a great advocate and admirer of Zongmi. Japanese Zen master Hakuin Ekaku (1685-1769) is a notable example of the ecumenical spirit of the Buddha Dharma that is reminiscent of both Chinul and Zongmi.<br /><br />Zongmi, Chinul, and even Hakuin all based their ecumenical view of Zen Buddha Dharma in the context of the One Vehicle. Zongmi and Chinul found their One Vehicle connection largely through the Avatamsaka Sutra and Hakuin found his One Vehicle connection through the Lotus Sutra. Bodhidharma of course began it all with the connection to the One Vehicle through the Lankavatara Sutra. To me the important point is not which sutra a particular teacher had most affinity with but that Zen has always had such a close connection to the One Vehicle regardless of any particular sutra; so much so, that we can honestly say that Zen is the One Vehicle. <br /><br />(continued due to size limit)Alan Gregory Wonderwheelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00186755261777539572noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7213937046537524165.post-56266051494138608562013-08-06T15:52:57.263-04:002013-08-06T15:52:57.263-04:00"Zen practitioners, subscribing to Bodhidharm..."Zen practitioners, subscribing to Bodhidharma's quasi-mythical maxim that Zen is beyond words (and thus connotatively reserved for the spiritual elite), like their Zen a certain way."<br /><br />For my money, it is a false and facile deduction ["connotatively"] to say that because Zen is sometimes described as being "beyond words" it is therefore elitist. I would agree that Zen -- and even Buddhism in general -- has a number of elitist tendencies ("a bunch of smart white guys" as an acquaintance of mine once put it), but what is "beyond words" hardly qualifies in that regard. Anyone who can sneeze or love or be wracked by grief -- irrespective of race, sex, education or income level -- knows there are matters that do not lend themselves to the self-annointing confines of words.<br /><br />I do agree that so-called teachers can present the matter in an upscale or elitist tone [dig my wisdom!], but that does not mean that "beyond words" is therefore elitist of itself.<br /><br />Just my two cents.genkakuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12135705172119950326noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7213937046537524165.post-25331555296753437362013-08-06T14:23:04.658-04:002013-08-06T14:23:04.658-04:00I completely agree, Joseph. MahayanaS all the way....I completely agree, Joseph. MahayanaS all the way. To borrow from the real estate mantra--"Upaya, upaya, UPAYA!" The moment we attach to a practice or teaching, we run the risk of reifying it. Thanks for your contribution, Joseph.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15848060825299066420noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7213937046537524165.post-26740397292099362732013-08-06T13:19:17.269-04:002013-08-06T13:19:17.269-04:00This is a good reminder. In the Mountains & Ri...This is a good reminder. In the Mountains & Rivers Order of (American) Zen, in which I am a student, we hit what feels to me like a sweet spot between tradition and innovation, but there are many modes of practice out there. The Diamond Sutra assures us the Dharma will survive. It's worth noticing that recent scholarship suggests there were in fact many Mahayanas even in the early days, with different codes of behavior and variations of doctrine--modern Zen continues this somewhat chaotic tradition. Joseph Duemerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07650314132179290321noreply@blogger.com